You had to get it

[Tom C]

Let say you just got back from your local dealer and found a koi you liked. The koi just got out of QT today from the dealer. You don't have a QT tank set-up, but you had to have the new koi. Since it just came out of QT, you should be safe adding this koi to your pond right. So you add it to the pond with all the rest of your pond pets.

I would like to hear what people have to say about this.

Tom

[The Other Lynda]

No way, no how. If I couldn't quarantine, I wouldn't buy it. Not going to risk losing my entire collection - fish I've know and loved for years, for "just another pretty face." That's my story, and I'm sticking to it! Good to "see" you, Tom! Are you coming to the AKCA Seminar in Tulsa in June???

[Tom C]

But Lynda the dealer QT them and they just came out of QT today. If my dealer QT them they must be fine right?

This is so far from the truth. Every new fish has to be QT by you or you do take a chance of problems. I am so glad you said no. I was going to get after anyone who said yes they are OK. I can tell you not all dealers QT the same. QT for some is adding them to a tank for a week or so to keeping a eye on them. They never take a scrape or do anything else. I have found parasites even on koi that I know the dealer real well. I got some new koi for my pond this winter and they were all QT by the dealers. I did have problems with anchor worms on them. If they were added to the pond this would have cost a lot more to treat the pond then it did in the QT tank.

If for some reason you have to have a koi always ask the dealer to hold it for you. Most dealers don't have a problem holding a koi for you for a week or so it you pay for it. This will give you some time to set the tank up. Always use media from you pond for the QT tank if it's not up and cycled.

Sorry, but I will not be able to make the AKCA Seminar in Tulsa in June. I will be out of town that week. I'm sure it's going to be a great Seminar.

Tom

[Ian]

I,d say how well do you know your dealer?
If it's a healthy fish why Qt ?
If the pond is up for another koi and a healthy pond I see no problems. I would love to get into this discussion in more depth but I've been working 24/7 and need some sleep.

[GregBickal]

My japanese koi came in January. So I have this very same situation. They were Shipped from Mark Bodycott who I trust and respect alot. He had quarenteened them at his place since November.

Since its winter time, and all of my koi are inside, these koi came inside. However, I didn't put them with my main herd, I put them in a tank of fingerlings. Koi that I could handle loosing.

This way, I could see if any bacteria that the new Japanese koi were carrying would affect my koi. My koi immediately came down with a cloudy slime coats. While the Japanese koi were fine. Scraped and scoped several times, found no evidence of anything. I slowly bumped the salt up to 6% and did a 2ppm PP treatment. After about 2 weeks, my koi had recovered just fine.

A few weeks later the bacteria made it to my other tank of koi through my fault of not properly sanitizing a pump that I use to clean my settling tanks. I had left the pump sit in a 5 gallon bucket with 5 pounds of dissolved salt for 6 hours. I should have followed Lukes recommendation of the bleach instead.
Followed the same regimine with those koi, and they are back to healthy.

I guess my sanitizing mistake was actually a good thing, because I would rather expose them to the bacteria in a smaller controlled indoor enviroment where I have exact water measurements.

If the new koi are carrying a bacteria, I dont think that quarenteen is going to matter much, that bacteria will eventually make it out to your population. But seing how it works on a few sacrificial koi would be my approach in the future.

So I say, always quarenteen, even if you have to build a new tank.

[luke frisbee]

But how in the heck can you reverse quarantine...I've brought home groups of fish that were more valuable than the ones at the house....i was worried about my homies passing something to the expensive ones...so i just tossed them all together...but then again all the fish had come from the same breeder except one (at that time) and I had been to his farm many times..just to stand around and watch..i would never help him for money or just a few fish as that might endanger my "hobbyist" standing and not allow me to get fish from another dealer at the show and drop them in the tank as if they were "mine". :frisbee:

[Ian]

How many gallons do you think is appropriate for Qt? I find over a 1000 gals makes a huge difference in stress levels on koi but more water the better after transport of more than a couple hours. A big room makes them at home:) If a Qt is not set up properly or not large enough to make the koi comfortable it can create troubles also.Taking a single koi to Qt will end up with poor results. Koi always have to have a buddy! With your own hands and a not so good set up you can risk your main pond too. Trying to Qt in a bucket so to speak is far more risky to your main pond as you can make your own nasties in this hobby.

[Jackie Ramo]

What size koi are you talking about? 3 5" koi would get lost in 1,000 gallons :frisbee:

[Ian]

Ahh thats the point Jackie. They love it if they have the choice to get lost and out of our faces for putting them in a little bag. A 3" to 5" koi takes how long to be 8 to 10" ? You never brought in Elf your chagoi this year, how come? I know I've had a few koi that barely made it out of Qt in spring with a 500gal.

[Mudsow]

1000 gal qt!! !wow! that's bigger than my pond! :lol:

My q tank is only 100 gal, but then again, I don't buy BIG fish. I don't know what I'd do now if one of my big guys actually got sick. Hmmm, treat the whole bunch I spoze. I would only think that they would all be affected anyway being in the same pond.

I like to keep 2 sponge filters running in the pond that way I can drag out the 100gal, throw in a mechanical filter and add an already cycled sponge filter if I need a Q-tank. It makes things MUCH easier that way.

That makes me really have to think about new fish. They have to be "tank worthy" I can't shop at the end of a day cause I'm too tired to drag out and set up. It does help keep impulse buys down though :D

Mudsow

[ozzyrockman]

Tom, I have been told by several dealers that their koi do not need to be qt'd because they are healthy and have been qt'd. BS !wow! !wow! A few years ago I bought 2 little koi and put them in a 750g qt, 3 months later I bought 6 more little guys put them in the qt tank and killed the first two we bought and two of the 6. I found out the dealer I bought the 6 from had only been in the US for two days and said nothing about qt.

I tried my hand at some domestics from a breeder down south and was told they don't need to be qt'd and guess what when they arrived I found three had costia.

I have qt'd 2 2-4" koi in a 55g aquarium for 1 1/2 months with a good filter, I have qt the same size in a 125g aquarium however I do prefer the 750 because it is outside, insultated, heated and now has a roof :D . The only way I would even consider placing one w/o qt is if the dealer scraped and scoped before the sale and I was able to see the results............... Allen

[Jackie Ramo]

Ian, I have 3 butterflies which are growing in the Q tank they share with a 24 inch guy. But a Q is not a home so the chagoi didn't come in. Frankly he shouldn't have stayed in last year but I pushed the limits with 5 fish one being 24 inches and the other 4 in their major growth year in 370 gallons and had to add a huge ugly TT to get through the winter.

The inside pond was built to hold one fish in particular through the winter, it acts as Q and hospital tank the rest of the time. It is no ones home, that's what the big pond is for.

Had I room I'd certainly expand the facilities but then I'd run it all season not just for the winter so it would no longer be a Q tank either.

[Ian]

O.k I suck at playing the devils advocate when it comes to QT. I think it is the very first thing to build before the pond :wink:
I can not think of any good reason why not to, accept if your putting the koi in a bad environment, than your just going to kill the koi or create your own parisite infestation and blame it on the dealer.
Pigs will fly when someone convinces me that under 500gals compared to plus 1000gallon Qt has on koi. I have seen the difference with my own eyes enough to realize it is not just a coincidence. The great thing is they are hardy creatures and can endure alot different environments. The odds change with every different factor that you add but the fist thing on hand is the netting , bowl , bag, sssssss...air(oxy), twist, rubberband box , car...rummble..rummble, maybe a vrrrrrrrooooommmm big old plane errrrrrrrr....bang bang, thump thump !strut and what the environment it goes into does play a roll in how the koi do. Have a set up as big a you can do and it will help or pay off if there is a problem. Lots to talk about really and it is a good topic.

[Jackie Ramo]

Well, I fully admit to having a pond for over 9 years and never had a q tank. Mind the only koi were the original ones so its not the same as adding fish.

Still I love the convenience now of having the extra place. I think people think it will be more work than it is worth but if you have it then you will use it and it is a nice place to get to know new fish.